and is it WRONG to think that DBSK >>> JE boys in terms of dancing & singing? please give me your opinions! :3
NO BASHING! i was just kidding!
Full Version: THSK VS JE artists
so who do you like more?! THSK or JE boys?
and is it WRONG to think that DBSK >>> JE boys in terms of dancing & singing? please give me your opinions! :3
NO BASHING! i was just kidding!
and is it WRONG to think that DBSK >>> JE boys in terms of dancing & singing? please give me your opinions! :3
NO BASHING! i was just kidding!
"Unlike Johnny’s Group, who are elegant, skinny, and the pretty faced type, which Japanese women like, TVXQ was more focused on bringing out each members individuality/personality and at the same time, with their tall heights, their fit bodies through exercise etc. they emphasized on manliness."
We need to understand that first of all, not ALL members of JE are "elegant, skinny and pretty faced". Of course at first sight, you would like specific members for their looks, once you get to know the group in general, you'll understand that each of them have their own strong points. Take Aiba Masaki from Arashi for example. I've never liked him for his looks. In fact he was the ONE person i didn't know when i was first introduced into Arashi. When i first got into Arashi, I loved Ninomiya but it was only after watching their variety shows that i came to love Aiba (In fact i came to LOVE Arashi because of their bond and not for their “pretty boy idol” looks). Aiba, while he barely acts in dramas and movies (I know all of the JE boys through dramas) and has that "nasally voice", he has his strong points in hosting and being an entertainer. He's just incredibly charismatic while being so dorky (AKA he's not afraid of being himself). This goes on for Matsujun, Nino, Ohno, and Sho too. I've never liked any of Matsujun's solos (And i do question his vocal abilities at times) yet he's very talented in terms of acting. Sho has his strong points in hosting and news casting while Ohno (Probably the most underrrated member) can ACTUALLY DANCE AND SING ON PAR TO KOREAN GROUPS. Also Keep in mind that Arash is also considered a sempai group, so its not about Youth and face that sells their CDS now, it's now all about the personality and talent. And they are INCREDIBLY successful while doing so (They are currently hold all #1 placements for the year on ORICON Charts)
While my points are not as strong as the other forum members and I mainly only focused on Arashi, i would just like to defend JE (I have nothing against DBSK) when it comes to the statement of ALL OF THEM IN GENERAL being "talentless pretty boys with no personalities". JE boys all have something they are talented at and we don't like them because they are pretty but because of their charisma and personalities and their ability to go out of that “pretty boy” image to find something that appeals to them as they grow up. (This is why many fans remain loyal to JE and also why JE has that strong “shelf life”)
While DBSK is able to dominate in singing and dancing, we can't say that they are better than JE OVERALL because in terms of other talents in the entertainment industry (Acting, hosting, musicals), JE is VERY strong on those aspects whereas DBSK may falter.
I hope I didn't offend anyone. I have nothing against DBSK but just wanted to prevent Korean fans from thinking that all JE members are talentless pretty boys with a lack of personality and not give JE a try.
We need to understand that first of all, not ALL members of JE are "elegant, skinny and pretty faced". Of course at first sight, you would like specific members for their looks, once you get to know the group in general, you'll understand that each of them have their own strong points. Take Aiba Masaki from Arashi for example. I've never liked him for his looks. In fact he was the ONE person i didn't know when i was first introduced into Arashi. When i first got into Arashi, I loved Ninomiya but it was only after watching their variety shows that i came to love Aiba (In fact i came to LOVE Arashi because of their bond and not for their “pretty boy idol” looks). Aiba, while he barely acts in dramas and movies (I know all of the JE boys through dramas) and has that "nasally voice", he has his strong points in hosting and being an entertainer. He's just incredibly charismatic while being so dorky (AKA he's not afraid of being himself). This goes on for Matsujun, Nino, Ohno, and Sho too. I've never liked any of Matsujun's solos (And i do question his vocal abilities at times) yet he's very talented in terms of acting. Sho has his strong points in hosting and news casting while Ohno (Probably the most underrrated member) can ACTUALLY DANCE AND SING ON PAR TO KOREAN GROUPS. Also Keep in mind that Arash is also considered a sempai group, so its not about Youth and face that sells their CDS now, it's now all about the personality and talent. And they are INCREDIBLY successful while doing so (They are currently hold all #1 placements for the year on ORICON Charts)
While my points are not as strong as the other forum members and I mainly only focused on Arashi, i would just like to defend JE (I have nothing against DBSK) when it comes to the statement of ALL OF THEM IN GENERAL being "talentless pretty boys with no personalities". JE boys all have something they are talented at and we don't like them because they are pretty but because of their charisma and personalities and their ability to go out of that “pretty boy” image to find something that appeals to them as they grow up. (This is why many fans remain loyal to JE and also why JE has that strong “shelf life”)
While DBSK is able to dominate in singing and dancing, we can't say that they are better than JE OVERALL because in terms of other talents in the entertainment industry (Acting, hosting, musicals), JE is VERY strong on those aspects whereas DBSK may falter.
I hope I didn't offend anyone. I have nothing against DBSK but just wanted to prevent Korean fans from thinking that all JE members are talentless pretty boys with a lack of personality and not give JE a try.
duh.......this news came from a Korean source so of course they'll praise Korean band....
no matter how they praise the boys, they sure can't surpass JE boys in Japan. Japan is JE boys' land . period . Nobody can top them in Japan .
no matter how they praise the boys, they sure can't surpass JE boys in Japan. Japan is JE boys' land . period . Nobody can top them in Japan .
I spent years watching every JE video, every JE variety show, drama, interview and performance. I've learned about many, many of the JE band's personalities and traits. I've seen bands be put together, and debut, and succeed. I still watch their dramas. I listened and purchased cds and dvds. I've many favorites from multiple albums.
My first DBSK song was Believe, and I first joked at how feminine Jaejoong looked. I followed up on their music, and absolutely fell in love with their acapella vocals. I did research, watched interviews, listened to albums and purchased official goods. I've watched them grow and develop in Japan.
I've got to say that DBSK is it. JE has a formula for producing his boys, which is as the article states. Looks, tv appeal, attitude to shine, and a flexible body for dance training. Comparing a JE band to DBSK just doesn't happen. JE is popular because of the legions of female fans in love with their personality and ideal traits (which is fine). DBSK has the largest official fanbase (not including japan's or any of the other countries, or any of the unofficial cassopeias), based on their music and vocal talent.
I compared DBSK to JE, and DBSK vocally fits together as one. JE vocally stacks. JE lacks in vibrato, and has difficulty achieving a solid falsetto. Live music-wise, JE lacks the strength to make a wholesome sound, and the vocals have difficulty staying in tune, usually going flat. The nasal sounds is evident because the artists have difficulty producing a solid sound since their vocal cords aren't meant to hit the upper register. Dancing isn't something to declare as a huge turning point because training is what makes dancing stand out.
To me, music is the most important thing, and JE just doesn't really sit par with DBSK. The music of DBSK is more mature, compared to JE productions. I feel that the fans make their artists overrated. I'll still continue to support JE, but I have to disagree when people state that JE is better then DBSK vocally, and is better because of popularity.
My first DBSK song was Believe, and I first joked at how feminine Jaejoong looked. I followed up on their music, and absolutely fell in love with their acapella vocals. I did research, watched interviews, listened to albums and purchased official goods. I've watched them grow and develop in Japan.
I've got to say that DBSK is it. JE has a formula for producing his boys, which is as the article states. Looks, tv appeal, attitude to shine, and a flexible body for dance training. Comparing a JE band to DBSK just doesn't happen. JE is popular because of the legions of female fans in love with their personality and ideal traits (which is fine). DBSK has the largest official fanbase (not including japan's or any of the other countries, or any of the unofficial cassopeias), based on their music and vocal talent.
I compared DBSK to JE, and DBSK vocally fits together as one. JE vocally stacks. JE lacks in vibrato, and has difficulty achieving a solid falsetto. Live music-wise, JE lacks the strength to make a wholesome sound, and the vocals have difficulty staying in tune, usually going flat. The nasal sounds is evident because the artists have difficulty producing a solid sound since their vocal cords aren't meant to hit the upper register. Dancing isn't something to declare as a huge turning point because training is what makes dancing stand out.
To me, music is the most important thing, and JE just doesn't really sit par with DBSK. The music of DBSK is more mature, compared to JE productions. I feel that the fans make their artists overrated. I'll still continue to support JE, but I have to disagree when people state that JE is better then DBSK vocally, and is better because of popularity.
I agree with Mao-chan.
It seems the article is mainly focused on the music side of things...but you're right, the JE guys do MANY things, not only do they sing, dance, perform, but they also act and host tv shows & radio...and in a some cases, perform in musicals & stage plays too. Acting is a mandatory requirement for the JE guys, it is part of their idol training, and some begin acting as young as 12. So there are some areas where the JE guys still holds the upper hand over DBSK, therefore it would be very bias to say that DBSK are "more talented" 'overall', when they still have some areas lagging behind the JE guys.
And it is true that JE is not all dependent on the looks...believe me, if it were all just down to their looks, then the Jimusho would've gone bankrupt years ago! It is because that these JE guys have so much more in them than just pretty faces, that they're able to carry on for so long. And like Mao-Chan mentioned before, some of the JE guys are already big senpais, already in their 30's & 40's, like the SMAP & TOKIO members, they've been in the business MUCH longer than DBSK and much of their kouhais have, they have more experience & understanding of the industry. The current senpais in the Jimusho all debuted in the late 80's and early 90's, they have all lasted this long, and some are still popular now.
It's also the same case with other senpais like Kinki Kids, who also debuted in the 90's, Arashi debuted in 1999, Tackey & Tsubasa etc...do ppl really think that they just depended on their looks to get them this far? Of course NOT! It is because they also have the talents to help them, and the personality & charisma that attracts all these fans, that they're able to last so long.
And then we have Jimusho's kouhai groups; KAT-TUN, NewS, Hey!Say!JUMP etc who debuted in the current decade...it's the same case with them too...although they're still quite new and less-experienced compared to their senpais, but some of them do still have talents, appeal, personality & charisma which attracts so many fans.
Another fact about the Jimusho I would like to point out to all those ppl who may not be familiar with the company, and don't know how it works. The Jimusho is a very different company to much of the other management agencies out there in the world, their strategies and structure are very different. They recruit young boys as early as in their childhood, as little as about 11 or 12 years old, and they start training them immediately. Once they sign a contract with the Jimusho, they're literally signing their entire career life as an adult until they retire from work! So their contracts could last up to 30, 40, or even 50 years with the Jimusho! Once they sign the contracts, they are bound to the company till they retire completely from their careers. So things work very differently with the Jimusho...unlike most, if not all other agencies in the world, which offers their artists contracts for several years, then the artists are able to decide whether or not they want to renew the contracts or change to another company.
In the Jimusho, there's no such thing, once you sign with them, you're stuck with them for life...or at least, till you retire. Although there has been some cases in the past when some of the guys left the Jimusho...either because the company itself let them go, or it was their own decision...but that still seldom happens in the company...usually you're bound to the Jimusho and it's really difficult to leave...unless things become too extreme and it seemed like there was no other option...or you break too many rules or some other reason and the company let's you go. However, these things are still a rarity in the Jimusho.
So you can imagine how hard these JE guys work, the Jimusho is very strict and gives their artists a lot of work, particularly those who have already debuted, they work virtually non-stop, their schedules are always full! And even those young kouhais who have yet to debut, still have to undergo their overwhelming training, and assisting their senpais.
And much of the JE guys have very little freedom, some are virtually like "puppets" to the Jimusho, very controlled by the company. So ALL the JE guys work very hard for their careers and they're all very dedicated to the workload that's given to them. So it really makes them no different to DBSK and all those others who work so hard and dedicate themselves so much to their work & careers. In a way, I actually really admire these JE guys...I mean...imagine, being signed under the same company for years till you actually retire, and with limited independence!
Although there are some JE guys who do still have more freedom and are less controlled than the rest.
It seems the article is mainly focused on the music side of things...but you're right, the JE guys do MANY things, not only do they sing, dance, perform, but they also act and host tv shows & radio...and in a some cases, perform in musicals & stage plays too. Acting is a mandatory requirement for the JE guys, it is part of their idol training, and some begin acting as young as 12. So there are some areas where the JE guys still holds the upper hand over DBSK, therefore it would be very bias to say that DBSK are "more talented" 'overall', when they still have some areas lagging behind the JE guys.
And it is true that JE is not all dependent on the looks...believe me, if it were all just down to their looks, then the Jimusho would've gone bankrupt years ago! It is because that these JE guys have so much more in them than just pretty faces, that they're able to carry on for so long. And like Mao-Chan mentioned before, some of the JE guys are already big senpais, already in their 30's & 40's, like the SMAP & TOKIO members, they've been in the business MUCH longer than DBSK and much of their kouhais have, they have more experience & understanding of the industry. The current senpais in the Jimusho all debuted in the late 80's and early 90's, they have all lasted this long, and some are still popular now.
It's also the same case with other senpais like Kinki Kids, who also debuted in the 90's, Arashi debuted in 1999, Tackey & Tsubasa etc...do ppl really think that they just depended on their looks to get them this far? Of course NOT! It is because they also have the talents to help them, and the personality & charisma that attracts all these fans, that they're able to last so long.
And then we have Jimusho's kouhai groups; KAT-TUN, NewS, Hey!Say!JUMP etc who debuted in the current decade...it's the same case with them too...although they're still quite new and less-experienced compared to their senpais, but some of them do still have talents, appeal, personality & charisma which attracts so many fans.
Another fact about the Jimusho I would like to point out to all those ppl who may not be familiar with the company, and don't know how it works. The Jimusho is a very different company to much of the other management agencies out there in the world, their strategies and structure are very different. They recruit young boys as early as in their childhood, as little as about 11 or 12 years old, and they start training them immediately. Once they sign a contract with the Jimusho, they're literally signing their entire career life as an adult until they retire from work! So their contracts could last up to 30, 40, or even 50 years with the Jimusho! Once they sign the contracts, they are bound to the company till they retire completely from their careers. So things work very differently with the Jimusho...unlike most, if not all other agencies in the world, which offers their artists contracts for several years, then the artists are able to decide whether or not they want to renew the contracts or change to another company.
In the Jimusho, there's no such thing, once you sign with them, you're stuck with them for life...or at least, till you retire. Although there has been some cases in the past when some of the guys left the Jimusho...either because the company itself let them go, or it was their own decision...but that still seldom happens in the company...usually you're bound to the Jimusho and it's really difficult to leave...unless things become too extreme and it seemed like there was no other option...or you break too many rules or some other reason and the company let's you go. However, these things are still a rarity in the Jimusho.
So you can imagine how hard these JE guys work, the Jimusho is very strict and gives their artists a lot of work, particularly those who have already debuted, they work virtually non-stop, their schedules are always full! And even those young kouhais who have yet to debut, still have to undergo their overwhelming training, and assisting their senpais.
And much of the JE guys have very little freedom, some are virtually like "puppets" to the Jimusho, very controlled by the company. So ALL the JE guys work very hard for their careers and they're all very dedicated to the workload that's given to them. So it really makes them no different to DBSK and all those others who work so hard and dedicate themselves so much to their work & careers. In a way, I actually really admire these JE guys...I mean...imagine, being signed under the same company for years till you actually retire, and with limited independence!
Although there are some JE guys who do still have more freedom and are less controlled than the rest.
First things first. I absolutely ADORE Tohoshinki not only because of their vocal skills and talent but because of their looks too.
I also ADORE JE groups and I really do not think that they are talentless! If you are making a success it cannot always be because of your looks. People HAVE brains they buy the cd's and listen to songs that ARE GOOD.
The person who wrote this IS biased and the "nasal" voice thing was something that was targetting matsujun BUT i want to say here that matsujun has that voice BUT nobody else can sing like him the arashi songs! His voice CANNOT be replaced by ANYONE.
Aiba has a unique voice and he also has talent as a singer and actor so those things about just looks I put them aside. Ninomiya... well... we all know that when he sang Niji ALL the fans were going crazy .. his voice is amazing.. i do not have to say here that he was also in HOLLYWOOD! OHNO SATOSHI -LEGEND! PURE TALENT IN EVERYTHING. And this is TRUE! Sho Sakurai: Amazing voice also steady voice and great rapping! So EVERYONE in ARASHI IS TALENTED. .. shall I say that they have th record for a CD that just has 1 new song and just OLD ones... they ALL BEST album has the record of sales for the year . kthx XD
Now KATTUN: They are ALL great singers and they DO have voice and yes they are appropriate for every kind of entertainment! Maybe their voices are not as unique as arashi BUT they are great and I like them.
SMAP: >.> I do not really care.
NEWS: OMG yamapi, ryo, tego + masu and shige they DO have great voices and saying that they have no singin or acting talent is like LYING!
THSK are a success because they have great songs and talent and they also dance very good not to mention the looks i do not think that they are better than arashi or worse I think though that in what they do they both excel and this is what really matters. Arashi are also very popular in Korea and they also have lots of fans all over Asia thus for those 10 years all the fans bought their ALL best album not just because the songs are amazing but for their collection. And I would also buy it if i was there like I would buy Tohoshinki (DONG BANG SHIN KI) CD's cause I ADORE THEM ALL.
Anyway I just said my opinion here... just because you are biased do not write something that will bias others it is not deontological at all!
I also ADORE JE groups and I really do not think that they are talentless! If you are making a success it cannot always be because of your looks. People HAVE brains they buy the cd's and listen to songs that ARE GOOD.
The person who wrote this IS biased and the "nasal" voice thing was something that was targetting matsujun BUT i want to say here that matsujun has that voice BUT nobody else can sing like him the arashi songs! His voice CANNOT be replaced by ANYONE.
Aiba has a unique voice and he also has talent as a singer and actor so those things about just looks I put them aside. Ninomiya... well... we all know that when he sang Niji ALL the fans were going crazy .. his voice is amazing.. i do not have to say here that he was also in HOLLYWOOD! OHNO SATOSHI -LEGEND! PURE TALENT IN EVERYTHING. And this is TRUE! Sho Sakurai: Amazing voice also steady voice and great rapping! So EVERYONE in ARASHI IS TALENTED. .. shall I say that they have th record for a CD that just has 1 new song and just OLD ones... they ALL BEST album has the record of sales for the year . kthx XD
Now KATTUN: They are ALL great singers and they DO have voice and yes they are appropriate for every kind of entertainment! Maybe their voices are not as unique as arashi BUT they are great and I like them.
SMAP: >.> I do not really care.
NEWS: OMG yamapi, ryo, tego + masu and shige they DO have great voices and saying that they have no singin or acting talent is like LYING!
THSK are a success because they have great songs and talent and they also dance very good not to mention the looks i do not think that they are better than arashi or worse I think though that in what they do they both excel and this is what really matters. Arashi are also very popular in Korea and they also have lots of fans all over Asia thus for those 10 years all the fans bought their ALL best album not just because the songs are amazing but for their collection. And I would also buy it if i was there like I would buy Tohoshinki (DONG BANG SHIN KI) CD's cause I ADORE THEM ALL.
Anyway I just said my opinion here... just because you are biased do not write something that will bias others it is not deontological at all!
lavender rain -
Even though this article is related to DBSK, but since the article itself also mentioned JE and was clearly comparing DBSK to the JE guys, I say having this debate with 'DBSK vs JE' is still ON topic
or maybe you should turn this into a 'DBSK vs JE' thread instead.
Even though this article is related to DBSK, but since the article itself also mentioned JE and was clearly comparing DBSK to the JE guys, I say having this debate with 'DBSK vs JE' is still ON topic
or maybe you should turn this into a 'DBSK vs JE' thread instead.
Lavender rain : even after you posted the news, you said "JE fans can kill me later" . So you do know that we're going to defend our JE boys. Why ? because the news described our boys "aren't vocally skilled" and so much more worse. We didn't put down DBSK. We just want to point out that JE boys are not all that talentless. Every country artists have their strong and weak point. This article clearly put our JE boys down while praising DBSK , which is understandable because it's a Korean news.
hey, we didn't bash you didn't we?
but C♥旬:聖:亀 and I just pointed out that we stayed on topic ( With no personal attack)
hey, we didn't bash you didn't we?
but C♥旬:聖:亀 and I just pointed out that we stayed on topic ( With no personal attack)
QUOTE (music.for.life. @ Oct 13 2009 8 28 AM) 
To me, music is the most important thing, and JE just doesn't really sit par with DBSK. The music of DBSK is more mature, compared to JE productions. I feel that the fans make their artists overrated. I'll still continue to support JE, but I have to disagree when people state that JE is better then DBSK vocally, and is better because of popularity.
I think when you mention "music", it depends on which part you're defining...are you referring to the music style, the vocals, the songs themselves? I think it just depends on personal preference...particularly when it comes to choosing the music style & songs, since everyone has different opinions & preferences on the music styles they listen to, and the songs they like.
For me personally, I don't really find the music from much of the JE groups all that appealing for me...KAT-TUN is the only JE group who I listen to on a regular basis
because their music styles & songs suit me and appeal to me more. Although yes, I agree with you that in terms of vocal power, DBSK are still more skilled than them and other JE guys. But I still love KAT-TUN with a passion nonetheless, and they are my ichiban! 
and they DO still have some vocal skills, I think they have a lot of potentials...just perhaps they're still not up to par with DBSK...yet.I also listen to DBSK sometimes...although I'm not that particularly enthusiastic about their music, but I do still enjoy some of their japanese songs.
I think to be a 'true' fan, not only do you embrace your idol's talents, strengths & traits, but it's important you also acknowledge their weaknesses too. That way, you are supporting them for their true selves, you love them for who they really are.
As much as I adore KAT-TUN, and I love them with a strong passion, but I also acknowledge their weaknesses too, and I accept that there are still some areas that they need improvement on. I believe this is what being a 'true' fan is, accepting your idol for who and how they are, including acknowledging their weaknesses, and being true to yourself.
So, although I agree that DBSK are more skilled vocally, but for me, KAT-TUN are still my ichiban overall & they are the best in my heart!
I was into the Japanese stuff before I ever got into Korean stuff so I do have a bit of an inclination on the JP side. But let's face it. The truth is while there are many talented Japanese artists, JE boys aren't among those. In other words, they're really not on the level of THSK. Some of JE songs I do like. They're easy to the ears and they're also easy to sing. I've been over in JP a few times and visited stores in Shibuya. The kind of promotion treatment JE gets in Japan is so many levels higher than THSK. If THSK gets that kind of exposure, there's no doubt in my mind that THSK will surpass the most popular group from JE. I'm very certain of that.
QUOTE
But let's face it. The truth is while there are many talented Japanese artists, JE boys aren't among those.
Like all here, you are VOICING YOUR OPINIONS, not stating the "truth". Saying that the JE boys are not among the talented Japanese artists is a OPINION, not a "fact". But you are entitled to your own opinions, just like everyone else are entitled to theirs too.
Like I mentioned before, I do agree that DBSK are more talented than the JE guys in terms of vocal skills...but 'overall'? I would not be so sure about that.
By doing this you do not appreciate the art behind them really it is a pitty. Every single JE guy has something to offer..have you listened to Tegoshi Yuya from NEWS sing? Yamapi? Ohno Satoshi? Have you seen him dancing? The guy has talent in everything.
Kat Tun are also great. I agree with the person above.
We all have our preferences and we should respect what others think
Also
stop comparing people that are totally different. There is no "mature" music what you mean is something else probably and I am not going to analyze it O_O
I think that DBSK are as good as Arashi, (Arashi is the best Japanese Boy Band really now! KAT TUN ARE ALSO AMAZING)
Anyway <3 I love them equally and I do think they are as talented . Most of JE's are very very talented though certain ones are not >.> -coughs nakai coughs-
Kat Tun are also great. I agree with the person above.
We all have our preferences and we should respect what others think
Also
stop comparing people that are totally different. There is no "mature" music what you mean is something else probably and I am not going to analyze it O_OI think that DBSK are as good as Arashi, (Arashi is the best Japanese Boy Band really now! KAT TUN ARE ALSO AMAZING)
Anyway <3 I love them equally and I do think they are as talented . Most of JE's are very very talented though certain ones are not >.> -coughs nakai coughs-
QUOTE (C♥旬:聖:ߙ @ Oct 13 2009 12 02 AM)
Like all here, you are VOICING YOUR OPINIONS, not stating the "truth". Saying that the JE boys are not among the talented Japanese artists is a OPINION, not a "fact". But you are entitled to your own opinions, just like everyone else are entitled to theirs too.
Like I mentioned before, I do agree that DBSK are more talented than the JE guys in terms of vocal skills...but 'overall'? I would not be so sure about that.
Like I mentioned before, I do agree that DBSK are more talented than the JE guys in terms of vocal skills...but 'overall'? I would not be so sure about that.
I have no intention to debate or argue with those who don't share my view because there's no point in that. I certainly am not debating with you or anyone here. I thought what we're doing here is pretty self explanatory. Do I have to talk like a 1st grader?
QUOTE (C♥旬:聖:ߙ @ Oct 12 2009 7 02 PM)
Like I mentioned before, I do agree that DBSK are more talented than the JE guys in terms of vocal skills...but 'overall'? I would not be so sure about that.
It's impossible to compare DBSK and JE's overall. This is because DBSK are SINGERS, their original concept was an acapella group, while JE boys are entertainers. JE are made to entertain, not made to sing, thats why the face matters, they act, they go on variety shows so often. So yes DBSK are DEFINITELY better SINGERS.
we all know dbsk have a high advantage in vocal capabilities but it seems like other than that they are also a little misunderstood. dbsk all have such distinctive and unique personality n modest n humble attitude i dont think they have ever left a bad impression on anyone who worked with them. almost all of the people they work with praise them to some extent. thier personalities are really suitable for hosting entertainment show or variety shows. Jaejoong can MC so natrually. they are all hilarious to watch as well.
i agree that if dbsk have the kind of promotion JE boys have than they will have alot more fans and sales. they will need that kind of exposure. its a very high probability becuz dbsk are always have to much potential. i dont think dbsk popularity will defeat arashi yet bcuz lets face it arashi have a huge steady fanbase for like 10 years. but there is a possibility.
dbsk is much more focus on thier music unlike JE. besides thier already obvious talent but its thier dedication to their passion that also help them excel. dbsk music is always changin thats one of the key factor that got me hook on thier music. they have a really wide range of genre n musical selection. each album will have some ballads some fast song n all these combination. they like to try out new thing n arent afraid to change. dbsk choreography as a group is much more vigorous then most JE i assume correct me if im wrong since i dont watch all of JE live. but the amount of sweat thsk have in concert is self explanatory lol.
JE have the upperhand in terms of acting bcuz like some said its a requirement for them. they have to be versatile in the entertainment circle. JE concept kinda reminds me of suju with so n so member actin or hostin dj sing dance in china or korea ect lol. only now have 3/5 of dbsk participated in a real drama. but if they were given the opportunity i think they all would excel in acting too. n honestly not all of JE can act some of them are quite bland. others like jun have more capability.
JE have 30+ year contract? 0.0 r u sure since i remember reading a member from kinki kids sue JE n change the contract length. alot of the jap shows i watch pertaining to dbsk contract lawsuit said that most jpan artist have less then 7 years contract with thier agency.
i agree that if dbsk have the kind of promotion JE boys have than they will have alot more fans and sales. they will need that kind of exposure. its a very high probability becuz dbsk are always have to much potential. i dont think dbsk popularity will defeat arashi yet bcuz lets face it arashi have a huge steady fanbase for like 10 years. but there is a possibility.
dbsk is much more focus on thier music unlike JE. besides thier already obvious talent but its thier dedication to their passion that also help them excel. dbsk music is always changin thats one of the key factor that got me hook on thier music. they have a really wide range of genre n musical selection. each album will have some ballads some fast song n all these combination. they like to try out new thing n arent afraid to change. dbsk choreography as a group is much more vigorous then most JE i assume correct me if im wrong since i dont watch all of JE live. but the amount of sweat thsk have in concert is self explanatory lol.
JE have the upperhand in terms of acting bcuz like some said its a requirement for them. they have to be versatile in the entertainment circle. JE concept kinda reminds me of suju with so n so member actin or hostin dj sing dance in china or korea ect lol. only now have 3/5 of dbsk participated in a real drama. but if they were given the opportunity i think they all would excel in acting too. n honestly not all of JE can act some of them are quite bland. others like jun have more capability.
JE have 30+ year contract? 0.0 r u sure since i remember reading a member from kinki kids sue JE n change the contract length. alot of the jap shows i watch pertaining to dbsk contract lawsuit said that most jpan artist have less then 7 years contract with thier agency.
.... at this thread.
Please don't bash these artists.
I don't think you should bash THSK because of an article like this. It's not like they wrote it.
& I actually don't see no bias at all.
I've love both je & thsk, and when I see fans bashing, comparing who's the best in japan etc, i feel negativity.
this article just states how much they have accomplished etc.
Mao-Chan - it DIDN'T say that JE boys had no personality. it just said that the agency focused on bringing out each thsk member's individuality.
I totally agree with what you just said. I've lived in Japan for years, and JE does have the upperhand when it come to exposure.
I wonder how much popular THSK would have been if they were under JE.
Please don't bash these artists.
I don't think you should bash THSK because of an article like this. It's not like they wrote it.
& I actually don't see no bias at all.
I've love both je & thsk, and when I see fans bashing, comparing who's the best in japan etc, i feel negativity.
this article just states how much they have accomplished etc.
Mao-Chan - it DIDN'T say that JE boys had no personality. it just said that the agency focused on bringing out each thsk member's individuality.
QUOTE (Hiroshi @ Oct 12 2009 2 54 PM)
The truth is while there are many talented Japanese artists, JE boys aren't among those. In other words, they're really not on the level of THSK. The kind of promotion treatment JE gets in Japan is so many levels higher than THSK. If THSK gets that kind of exposure, there's no doubt in my mind that THSK will surpass the most popular group from JE. I'm very certain of that.
I totally agree with what you just said. I've lived in Japan for years, and JE does have the upperhand when it come to exposure.
I wonder how much popular THSK would have been if they were under JE.
thi is so wrong... TVXQ is not the top of j-pop...
arashi is!! we all know that...
arashi currently holds the #1 in the yearly oricon for 3 different categories... #1 for singles, #1 for DVD music sales, #1 for album sales...
they said that TVXQ has #1 but only in the weekly sales... they only sold around 100,000...
do u guys remember when arashi and tvxq released singles the same day on july 1...
tvxq- stand by u
arashi- everything
arashi got no.1 spot for that, TVXQ only got no.2...
and the number of sales has a very huge gap between #1 and #2...
arashi sold 500,000+ and TVXQ only sold 100,000+...
that is a huge gap...
i think they compared TVXQ to JE because JE is really more popular than them!!! ESPECIALLY ARASHI...
no one can beat arashi...
they are the best...
event though, tvxq might be better at singing tham arashi, OHNO SATOSHI (arashi) alone is much better than all TVXQ!!! and he's very very good at SINGING AND DANCING!!!
you should watch him, he's brilliant!!!
ARASHI IS THE TOP OF J-POP!!!!!!!!!!!!!
arashi is!! we all know that...
arashi currently holds the #1 in the yearly oricon for 3 different categories... #1 for singles, #1 for DVD music sales, #1 for album sales...
they said that TVXQ has #1 but only in the weekly sales... they only sold around 100,000...
do u guys remember when arashi and tvxq released singles the same day on july 1...
tvxq- stand by u
arashi- everything
arashi got no.1 spot for that, TVXQ only got no.2...
and the number of sales has a very huge gap between #1 and #2...
arashi sold 500,000+ and TVXQ only sold 100,000+...
that is a huge gap...
i think they compared TVXQ to JE because JE is really more popular than them!!! ESPECIALLY ARASHI...
no one can beat arashi...
they are the best...
event though, tvxq might be better at singing tham arashi, OHNO SATOSHI (arashi) alone is much better than all TVXQ!!! and he's very very good at SINGING AND DANCING!!!
you should watch him, he's brilliant!!!
ARASHI IS THE TOP OF J-POP!!!!!!!!!!!!!
QUOTE (Hiroshi @ Oct 13 2009 10 21 AM)
I have no intention to debate or argue with those who don't share my view because there's no point in that. I certainly am not debating with you or anyone here. I thought what we're doing here is pretty self explanatory. Do I have to talk like a 1st grader?
and neither do I take pleasure in arguing or debating with others who have different views to mine.
I just want people to understand that we're all just voicing our own opinions here.
QUOTE (SooRi @ Oct 13 2009 11 55 AM)
It's impossible to compare DBSK and JE's overall. This is because DBSK are SINGERS, their original concept was an acapella group, while JE boys are entertainers. JE are made to entertain, not made to sing, thats why the face matters, they act, they go on variety shows so often. So yes DBSK are DEFINITELY better SINGERS.
this was my point exactly...often ppl compare DBSK to the JE guys as a complete package, and not just the music side of things...which in my opinion is bias, because they're different, DBSK is mainly focused on their music, while the JE guys are all-round idols and entertainers. So of course there's still some areas where the JE guys have the upper hand. Some of the JE guys are skilled in acting, and hosting tv shows & radios, these areas DBSK lack, because they're not like the JE guys, they're not even in the same boat. DBSK is mainly a music group, the JE guys are idol groups who do virtually everything in showbiz.
Therefore, when you're comparing DBSK with the JE guys in terms of vocal skills, it's understandable if DBSK are more skilled vocally, because singing is their main focus. With the JE guys, they focus on many different areas of entertainment. But some of the JE guys do still have vocal and musical talents too, and are also skilled performers.
It's just sad to see that often idols and idol groups are stereotyped as being "talentless pretty faces" or have limited talents and mostly dependent on their looks & appearance. There's still some idols out there who ARE still talented and skilled at what they do, and I think some of the JE guys are among these more talented idols.
So it's really impossible to compare the JE guys with DBSK 'overall', this was what I meant about the whole "don't be so sure" part, because it is difficult to compare them when they're so different to each other.
DBSK may be more skilled vocally, but the JE guys have the versatility in showbiz as all-round idols & entertainers.
QUOTE (Yoosutic @ Oct 13 2009 12 15 PM)
JE have 30+ year contract? 0.0 r u sure since i remember reading a member from kinki kids sue JE n change the contract length. alot of the jap shows i watch pertaining to dbsk contract lawsuit said that most jpan artist have less then 7 years contract with thier agency.
it's true, like I mentioned before...the Jimusho works very differently to much of the other Japanese agencies & management agencies out there in the world. Unlike other agencies, the Jimusho's contracts are very lengthy and generally lasts till their artists retire. Although there were still times when a JE guy wants to leave, or complain about the length of the contract, and sometimes they were let go by the company...but it still doesn't happen very often in the Jimusho. Many of the senpais in JE have been with the company for decades, some have been a JE guy since the 80's. While the eldest senpais of JE were in the company since the 60's before they retired decades later.
So the Jimusho works very differently to other Japanese agencies and companies in the world. The Jimusho is like a "second home" to their artists because they literally grew up in the company, they were recruited and trained vigorously since childhood, and shaped into idols by the Jimusho as they grow up...and most of the time, they stay with the Jimusho all throughout their career years.
It's a different case with much, if not all, other talent agencies in the world. 7 years is approximately about the maximum length of a regular contract with other Japanese agencies...but not with the Jimusho.
Unlike artists from other agencies who have the freedom to choose whether or not to renew their contracts, or move to another agency once their current contracts end.
The JE guys don't have this kind of freedom...although, in some cases, the Jimusho's contracts do last for much less time, like at least 6 years. However, generally the JE guys end up renewing their contracts with the Jimusho anyway and stay with the company for decades.
The Jimusho is very strict, once you sign a contract with them, it's difficult for you to leave. Even if you have only been in the company for about 7 years & your contract is about to expire, it's like you still don't have a choice but to renew with the company.
The only times when a JE guy leaves the Jimusho are...
1) for any reason the company is very unhappy or dissatisfied with him, maybe he broke too many rules, or just "not good enough" for the company...then the Jimusho dismisses him.
2) either or both parties resort to legal action if the dispute becomes serious...if the JE guy succeeds, then he is free to go.
but for much of those dismissed cases, it was the former.
All in all, dismissed cases like this still don't happen very often in the Jimusho...most of the time these guys stay with the company for decades, or till they retire.
This thread is actually much more peaceful than I thought.
Just wanna say I understand JE's fans this time perfectly (even though I'm DBSK's fan). Why? Because the very same thing happens to DBSK whenever there is a topic of DBSK vs. another Korean boyband/artists comes up. It's pretty interesting to see them being treated as real artists in Jpop scene and as idols in Kpop scene. I can't remember how many times I got angry when someone bashed DBSK, saying we fans like them only because of their looks, how they can't be compared to the current bands, how they are not the "IT" thing anymore, blah blah blah, and we argued with these people exactly like how JE's fans are defending their favorite bands now. Worse is whenever a competition (specifically polls) is going on, if the fans from other bands see their bands are losing, they will team up to vote for DBSK's rival just to take them down. I really hate that so much (but of course Cassie would not let that happen lol ^^)
I can't compare JE's groups to DBSK, mostly because they are so different. One is for music only and the other is all-rounder entertainers. Will not say anything about hard working because I believe every single celeb out there is working really hard to be where they are today. I don't listen to Jpop, even if I do, I only listen to female singers coz Japanese male singers' voices just...don't appeal to me. I have tried several times listening to different singers from different genres, but, still doesn't work. So, for me, DBSk wins, vocally.
Of course DBSK's popularity is nowhere near Arashi or Kat Tun (and many other popular singers) but don't u think for a foreign boyband to achieve such popularity in Japan is pretty admirable? And it's through their music only. For people to even compare them to these bands are pretty amazing, not to mention the fact that these bands have been around much longer and it's their homeland, their territory ^^.
Many people say: "DBSK can never win over JE's big shots" but I think otherwise, they are known for making the impossible possible. When they debuted in Japan, they only sold some thousands copies, and their sell keeps going up everytime they release something new. I will wait for the day they can sell millions. I like to think positive ^^.
Just wanna say I understand JE's fans this time perfectly (even though I'm DBSK's fan). Why? Because the very same thing happens to DBSK whenever there is a topic of DBSK vs. another Korean boyband/artists comes up. It's pretty interesting to see them being treated as real artists in Jpop scene and as idols in Kpop scene. I can't remember how many times I got angry when someone bashed DBSK, saying we fans like them only because of their looks, how they can't be compared to the current bands, how they are not the "IT" thing anymore, blah blah blah, and we argued with these people exactly like how JE's fans are defending their favorite bands now. Worse is whenever a competition (specifically polls) is going on, if the fans from other bands see their bands are losing, they will team up to vote for DBSK's rival just to take them down. I really hate that so much (but of course Cassie would not let that happen lol ^^)
I can't compare JE's groups to DBSK, mostly because they are so different. One is for music only and the other is all-rounder entertainers. Will not say anything about hard working because I believe every single celeb out there is working really hard to be where they are today. I don't listen to Jpop, even if I do, I only listen to female singers coz Japanese male singers' voices just...don't appeal to me. I have tried several times listening to different singers from different genres, but, still doesn't work. So, for me, DBSk wins, vocally.
Of course DBSK's popularity is nowhere near Arashi or Kat Tun (and many other popular singers) but don't u think for a foreign boyband to achieve such popularity in Japan is pretty admirable? And it's through their music only. For people to even compare them to these bands are pretty amazing, not to mention the fact that these bands have been around much longer and it's their homeland, their territory ^^.
Many people say: "DBSK can never win over JE's big shots" but I think otherwise, they are known for making the impossible possible. When they debuted in Japan, they only sold some thousands copies, and their sell keeps going up everytime they release something new. I will wait for the day they can sell millions. I like to think positive ^^.
I agree that we shouldn't compare THSK with the JE guys, because they are different. THSK is a music group, so their attention is on their music. but the JE guys are all-round idols and do many things. They all have their own talents. Because they are different to each other, THSK are better in some things, but JE guys are also better than THSK in other things too. So it's hard to compare. And it is also true that as entertainers and performers, the JE guys are more versatile, because they do many things, not just music. But THSK is mainly on music.
But there is no doubt that there are some very talented guys in the JE too when it comes to their music and performance. And I agree that Kat-tun is undoubtfully some of the most talented! And so is Ohno Satoshi from Arashi. The Kinki Kids are also very talented at the work they do. Some of the JE guys are truly very talented and versatile.
But there is no doubt that there are some very talented guys in the JE too when it comes to their music and performance. And I agree that Kat-tun is undoubtfully some of the most talented! And so is Ohno Satoshi from Arashi. The Kinki Kids are also very talented at the work they do. Some of the JE guys are truly very talented and versatile.
in music wise, THSK wins~
since i only follow the music, so i only know that THSK wins..
as JE groups, i used to like some of their music, but only some of the songs.. when i finally found out THSK, i quickly drawn into them..
JE groups should have another great talents in another fields, like acting, hosting which THSK don't do..so both have their own great aspects..
JE for me is more like idol group since they coverage in almost all areas, singing, dancing, acting, hosting, and etc....
which i prefer one artist should just focus in just one area..
and i kinda think that JE groups are much better being actors, because they're pretty good as actors, as for singing groups, hmm nah~ i feel that their way of singing are not different from one to another, most of them have this kind of the same way of singing~
once again, both groups have different aspects.. so can't really compare them~
since i only follow the music, so i only know that THSK wins..
as JE groups, i used to like some of their music, but only some of the songs.. when i finally found out THSK, i quickly drawn into them..
JE groups should have another great talents in another fields, like acting, hosting which THSK don't do..so both have their own great aspects..
JE for me is more like idol group since they coverage in almost all areas, singing, dancing, acting, hosting, and etc....
which i prefer one artist should just focus in just one area..
and i kinda think that JE groups are much better being actors, because they're pretty good as actors, as for singing groups, hmm nah~ i feel that their way of singing are not different from one to another, most of them have this kind of the same way of singing~
once again, both groups have different aspects.. so can't really compare them~
True, even though many of the JE guys have similar ways of singing, or have similar vocals, that does NOT necessarily mean they "can't" sing, or are not talented in that area. Some of the JE guys are truly very talented actors AND singers & have great music too, some of them are skilled at other areas of profession too. It depends on each group, much of the JE groups' music are similar & quite limited...while KAT-TUN is only among the few JE groups whose music range is broader & they sing a wider range of different types of music.
Of course, their music does not appeal to everyone, so it just depends on personal preference.
Although the JE groups are known as idol groups & do a whole heap of different things, that does NOT necessarily mean that they don't have the skills to be fantastic singers & performers too, some of them are truly talented musically also.
It's just sad that some ppl stereotype the JE guys & idol groups in general like this...I'm not specifically referring to you...but it is quite sad with this stereotype...and what's worse is that some of the ppl who generalize these JE guys, are not even that familiar with the JE and its artists anyway...some of them don't even pay any closer attention to the JE guys & just judge from the surface only, which is very bias
And it's true...DBSK may be more talented than the JE guys musically, but the JE guys are also much more skilled than DBSK in other areas, such as acting & host etc...which the DBSK members have very little or no skills at whatsoever. It comes back to what we had discussed before, that it's difficult to compare DBSK with the JE guys, because they're different. They all have their own traits, skills & flaws...DBSK may be more talented than the JE guys musically, but at the same time, the JE guys also have their own strengths & advantages over the DBSK members.
Of course, their music does not appeal to everyone, so it just depends on personal preference.
Although the JE groups are known as idol groups & do a whole heap of different things, that does NOT necessarily mean that they don't have the skills to be fantastic singers & performers too, some of them are truly talented musically also.
It's just sad that some ppl stereotype the JE guys & idol groups in general like this...I'm not specifically referring to you...but it is quite sad with this stereotype...and what's worse is that some of the ppl who generalize these JE guys, are not even that familiar with the JE and its artists anyway...some of them don't even pay any closer attention to the JE guys & just judge from the surface only, which is very bias
And it's true...DBSK may be more talented than the JE guys musically, but the JE guys are also much more skilled than DBSK in other areas, such as acting & host etc...which the DBSK members have very little or no skills at whatsoever. It comes back to what we had discussed before, that it's difficult to compare DBSK with the JE guys, because they're different. They all have their own traits, skills & flaws...DBSK may be more talented than the JE guys musically, but at the same time, the JE guys also have their own strengths & advantages over the DBSK members.
^
yea, it's kind of sad that not many ppl notice JE groups also have other talents.. but maybe, nowadays ppl are more concern about music more than variety shows/movies/dramas?
well, to be honest, before i really really drawn into KPop world, i used to be JE groups' fans.. like NewS, Kanjani8, the duo TXT.. and etc.. i was so so so so so so into Jpop because i was a big fan, even until now though, but i only limited my self to the Japanese soloists...
because once i found out DBSK/TVXQ/Tohoshinki, they totally attracted me with their voices and their music.. maybe i'm a kind of a fan who really just expect an artist who should just focus on what he was trained for back then, because it just kind of making me confusing with so many area of expertises that some of artists try to pursue, like the JE boys.. whenever i listen to their new singles/albums, i don't know, maybe it's only me, they sound always the same..not like before when i used to really love to listen to their music..once i listen to their latest songs, i just can't repeat it again and again..
and since i'm seeing that JE groups are mostly releasing music these days, so i guess that they're more focus on singing rather than dramas? because not all JE groups members are acting right? all i know that just some of them are great actors..but still, they will always release new music..and to be honest, their music is kind of repetitive...it's very JE-ish~~ haha..
it's kind of easy to predict..
sorry no offense ok.. i still listen to their music, i still love it, but just i'm not that interested in them anymore.. but well, it's a matter of taste though.. i can't blame ppl who will think TVXQ is better than JE, or JE is better from TVXQ... i've also met some fans who were used to like TVXQ but now lost interest with them too.. guess that it's the nature~ haha~~
yea, it's kind of sad that not many ppl notice JE groups also have other talents.. but maybe, nowadays ppl are more concern about music more than variety shows/movies/dramas?
well, to be honest, before i really really drawn into KPop world, i used to be JE groups' fans.. like NewS, Kanjani8, the duo TXT.. and etc.. i was so so so so so so into Jpop because i was a big fan, even until now though, but i only limited my self to the Japanese soloists...
because once i found out DBSK/TVXQ/Tohoshinki, they totally attracted me with their voices and their music.. maybe i'm a kind of a fan who really just expect an artist who should just focus on what he was trained for back then, because it just kind of making me confusing with so many area of expertises that some of artists try to pursue, like the JE boys.. whenever i listen to their new singles/albums, i don't know, maybe it's only me, they sound always the same..not like before when i used to really love to listen to their music..once i listen to their latest songs, i just can't repeat it again and again..
and since i'm seeing that JE groups are mostly releasing music these days, so i guess that they're more focus on singing rather than dramas? because not all JE groups members are acting right? all i know that just some of them are great actors..but still, they will always release new music..and to be honest, their music is kind of repetitive...it's very JE-ish~~ haha..
it's kind of easy to predict..
sorry no offense ok.. i still listen to their music, i still love it, but just i'm not that interested in them anymore.. but well, it's a matter of taste though.. i can't blame ppl who will think TVXQ is better than JE, or JE is better from TVXQ... i've also met some fans who were used to like TVXQ but now lost interest with them too.. guess that it's the nature~ haha~~
^perhaps Jpop was just a phase for you? Like how Kpop was for me...I used to be very into Kpop & Korean stuff myself, but then I got over them because I became bored of their repetitiveness...and Korean music is just so heavily adapted from the west that they just sound like Korean versions of Western music.
There's still more originality with Japanese music, and that's 1 reason why I love Jpop & Jrock, they still retain some of their own original & unique music style. I've loved Jpop & Japanese pop culture since I was very young...you could say I virtually grew up with Japanese stuff, since some of my relatives are half-Japanese anyway, so I was heavily influenced by Japanese pop culture since very little. And it has always overwhelmed me...even when I went through that phase with Kpop & Korean dramas, I still spent a lot of time with Japanese pop culture...this sort of "obsession" I have with Japanese pop culture only escalated even more after I lost interest in Korean stuff some years ago.
Some ppl do prefer artists to just stick to 1 area of profession, as oppose to doing a whole heap of different things...but that's the difference between all-around idols & artist who solely do 1 thing, like music groups. I personally don't see what is so bad with being a all-round idol...I mean, sure, they may not be able to spend as much time improving their music skills as music artists do, in turn perhaps they improve more slowly. But it's hard being a all-round idol, since you do different things, you have to focus on so many different areas of profession, it's complicated. All-round idols like the JE guys have to work extra hard, with their minds focusing on so many different areas spontaneously, it's stressful. From this perspective, idols have a great deal of respect from me. But I think this helps them grow in many ways, and building up their versatility.
Unlike music artists such as DBSK, who only has to devote much of their time perfecting their music, they don't have to work as hard as all-round idols do, and work is less complicated for them.
I agree with you about the music of JE guys...it's very repetitive, and frankly, I quite dislike that. Most of the JE groups have the same music style, I've heard many songs from other JE groups, and they're just not that interesting...always the same kind of songs & music over & over again...sure I enjoy listening to them about once or twice, but I soon get bored of them. This is why I much prefer listening to KAT-TUN; they're the only JE group I listen to on a regular basis, because they have a broader range of music compared to most of the other JE groups, they sing a more variety of different types of music. Not only do they sing jpop, they also sing jrock, ballads, even some RnB...KOKI himself also sings hard rock/heavy metal music & Ueda I heard also sings some folk music.
Each of the 6 members are also unique in their own ways with their own distinctiveness, I love the dynamic of KAT-TUN (not saying that the other JE groups are not unique in their own ways too), and their songs are always very catchy (for me anyway), I can listen to their songs over & over again and never get tired of them! You can say, they are the only JE group I'm 'truly' a fan of!
Anyway, I also listen to KAT-TUN's senpai TOKIO sometimes, their music range is also very similar to theirs, like KAT-TUN, TOKIO has more variety in their music. These 2 are the only few groups in JE (from what I've noticed so far) who have this kind of music range.
It's true though that the JE guys are more focused on music nowadays, seeing that many have been releasing a lot of cds over the years...although the Johnny Jimusho have always focused a lot on music...but I think nowadays, they've perhaps increased their attention on this area even more...my guess is probably because now there's a lot of competition in the Japanese music industry, certainly with the existence of DBSK known as 'Tohoshinki' over there. As oppose to let's say, back in the 90's when the 'Japanese wave' was at its peak & Japanese stuff dominated the whole of asia...at the time, JE guys dominated the whole of asia,
things were probably not that competitive for the Jimusho back then, than it is today. Although the popularity & dominance of the JE guys (mainly the very famous who have already debuted) is still feverishly high in Japan & some parts of asia too...but it's also true that there's now some very tough competition out there for the Jimusho. I think this has perhaps given Johnny Jimusho the urge to increase their attention in the music industry.
But of course, acting and hosting still remains among their main focuses too.
It's true that not all JE guys act, but again, not all of them sing either, or host a TV show, or have their own radio show. Let's not forget that the Jimusho not only has their mainstream all-around idols...but they also have some dance groups too, these groups never debut, nor do they sing, or act, or host, or do anything else like their fellow JE senpais who have debuted. Instead, these dance groups are how they are labeled to be; dance groups, they mainly just remain as backup dancers for other JE guys, and they do nothing else...and sometimes these dance groups are not permanent, often some of them are just temporary units.
KAT-TUN for instance, was initially suppose to be just a dance group for their senpai Domoto Koichi from Kinki Kids, but they attracted so much attention that Johnny Kitagawa-san finally allowed them to debut as a solid JE idol group. Thankfully! Since I'm such a avid fan of KT! I'm so grateful to Kitagawa-san for letting KT debut as a official group!
There's also other guys in the Jimusho who have yet to debut, like the Johnny Jrs...they are still in training, so are not focused much on music just yet...although some of them have already began to act.
Johnny Jimusho is huge, they have heaps of artists, much more than some may suspect...all the JE groups we see debuting, releasing cds & dvds, holding concerts, acting, hosting etc, all the ones who are being pushed & exposed in the spotlight...they are only just a percentage of the whole population of JE guys...I'm not 100% sure how much...but I'm guessing they probably make up roughly about 40-50% of all the JE guys in the company...but that's just a rough estimate.
The Jimusho has heaps of other JE guys who work in the background, out of the spotlight, they will never get to debut, never release a cd of their own, never host, or even act, as long as they are in the company...even though some of them have been trained in these areas. All they mainly do is shadow work; working in the background to support & assist their senpais, those JE guys who have already debuted.
This is another aspect I dislike about JE...they treat some of their artists very unfairly, without giving them a chance to do their own thing, give them the chance to debut & have the real experience of being idols etc...even if some of them have already been trained to...instead, they're being restrained to just doing background work & assisting other JE groups.
I've observed some of these less fortunate JE guys, and I think some of them really have potentials...but the company is just not giving them the chance to grow & thrive...and that's what annoys me
So to some extent, I do like the JE & often support them...but at the same time, there's also some aspects about the company which I dislike & don't support.
There's still more originality with Japanese music, and that's 1 reason why I love Jpop & Jrock, they still retain some of their own original & unique music style. I've loved Jpop & Japanese pop culture since I was very young...you could say I virtually grew up with Japanese stuff, since some of my relatives are half-Japanese anyway, so I was heavily influenced by Japanese pop culture since very little. And it has always overwhelmed me...even when I went through that phase with Kpop & Korean dramas, I still spent a lot of time with Japanese pop culture...this sort of "obsession" I have with Japanese pop culture only escalated even more after I lost interest in Korean stuff some years ago.
Some ppl do prefer artists to just stick to 1 area of profession, as oppose to doing a whole heap of different things...but that's the difference between all-around idols & artist who solely do 1 thing, like music groups. I personally don't see what is so bad with being a all-round idol...I mean, sure, they may not be able to spend as much time improving their music skills as music artists do, in turn perhaps they improve more slowly. But it's hard being a all-round idol, since you do different things, you have to focus on so many different areas of profession, it's complicated. All-round idols like the JE guys have to work extra hard, with their minds focusing on so many different areas spontaneously, it's stressful. From this perspective, idols have a great deal of respect from me. But I think this helps them grow in many ways, and building up their versatility.
Unlike music artists such as DBSK, who only has to devote much of their time perfecting their music, they don't have to work as hard as all-round idols do, and work is less complicated for them.
I agree with you about the music of JE guys...it's very repetitive, and frankly, I quite dislike that. Most of the JE groups have the same music style, I've heard many songs from other JE groups, and they're just not that interesting...always the same kind of songs & music over & over again...sure I enjoy listening to them about once or twice, but I soon get bored of them. This is why I much prefer listening to KAT-TUN; they're the only JE group I listen to on a regular basis, because they have a broader range of music compared to most of the other JE groups, they sing a more variety of different types of music. Not only do they sing jpop, they also sing jrock, ballads, even some RnB...KOKI himself also sings hard rock/heavy metal music & Ueda I heard also sings some folk music.
Each of the 6 members are also unique in their own ways with their own distinctiveness, I love the dynamic of KAT-TUN (not saying that the other JE groups are not unique in their own ways too), and their songs are always very catchy (for me anyway), I can listen to their songs over & over again and never get tired of them! You can say, they are the only JE group I'm 'truly' a fan of!
Anyway, I also listen to KAT-TUN's senpai TOKIO sometimes, their music range is also very similar to theirs, like KAT-TUN, TOKIO has more variety in their music. These 2 are the only few groups in JE (from what I've noticed so far) who have this kind of music range.
It's true though that the JE guys are more focused on music nowadays, seeing that many have been releasing a lot of cds over the years...although the Johnny Jimusho have always focused a lot on music...but I think nowadays, they've perhaps increased their attention on this area even more...my guess is probably because now there's a lot of competition in the Japanese music industry, certainly with the existence of DBSK known as 'Tohoshinki' over there. As oppose to let's say, back in the 90's when the 'Japanese wave' was at its peak & Japanese stuff dominated the whole of asia...at the time, JE guys dominated the whole of asia,
things were probably not that competitive for the Jimusho back then, than it is today. Although the popularity & dominance of the JE guys (mainly the very famous who have already debuted) is still feverishly high in Japan & some parts of asia too...but it's also true that there's now some very tough competition out there for the Jimusho. I think this has perhaps given Johnny Jimusho the urge to increase their attention in the music industry.
But of course, acting and hosting still remains among their main focuses too.
It's true that not all JE guys act, but again, not all of them sing either, or host a TV show, or have their own radio show. Let's not forget that the Jimusho not only has their mainstream all-around idols...but they also have some dance groups too, these groups never debut, nor do they sing, or act, or host, or do anything else like their fellow JE senpais who have debuted. Instead, these dance groups are how they are labeled to be; dance groups, they mainly just remain as backup dancers for other JE guys, and they do nothing else...and sometimes these dance groups are not permanent, often some of them are just temporary units.
KAT-TUN for instance, was initially suppose to be just a dance group for their senpai Domoto Koichi from Kinki Kids, but they attracted so much attention that Johnny Kitagawa-san finally allowed them to debut as a solid JE idol group. Thankfully! Since I'm such a avid fan of KT!
I'm so grateful to Kitagawa-san for letting KT debut as a official group!There's also other guys in the Jimusho who have yet to debut, like the Johnny Jrs...they are still in training, so are not focused much on music just yet...although some of them have already began to act.
Johnny Jimusho is huge, they have heaps of artists, much more than some may suspect...all the JE groups we see debuting, releasing cds & dvds, holding concerts, acting, hosting etc, all the ones who are being pushed & exposed in the spotlight...they are only just a percentage of the whole population of JE guys...I'm not 100% sure how much...but I'm guessing they probably make up roughly about 40-50% of all the JE guys in the company...but that's just a rough estimate.
The Jimusho has heaps of other JE guys who work in the background, out of the spotlight, they will never get to debut, never release a cd of their own, never host, or even act, as long as they are in the company...even though some of them have been trained in these areas. All they mainly do is shadow work; working in the background to support & assist their senpais, those JE guys who have already debuted.
This is another aspect I dislike about JE...they treat some of their artists very unfairly, without giving them a chance to do their own thing, give them the chance to debut & have the real experience of being idols etc...even if some of them have already been trained to...instead, they're being restrained to just doing background work & assisting other JE groups.
I've observed some of these less fortunate JE guys, and I think some of them really have potentials...but the company is just not giving them the chance to grow & thrive...and that's what annoys me
So to some extent, I do like the JE & often support them...but at the same time, there's also some aspects about the company which I dislike & don't support.
^
i like reading your posts, i think they make alot of sense but nevertheless i dont agree with that statement. i understand our oppinions vary but i think thats unfair to say that dbsk dont have to work as hard as all-round-idols. Just because dbsk dont venture off into other categories within the Ent. Indus. doesnt make them any less hardworking. While "all-rounder-idols" are constantly training and improving in different areas, they are generally just skimming the surface. Whereas, though DBSK dont exactly "explore" the other parts of the industry, they are exploring and music wise more "indepth". Like you said earlier that JE artists tend to have a "repiditiveness" in their music. JE idols unfortunately arent given the chance to furtehr study music and improve. Im not trying to degrade either, all i want to say it that; while "all-rounder-idols" are working on a range of projects, dbsk are working too, maybe not on the same tasks but working nonetheless. Their hardwork and effort could be seen by how far theyve come, their music and last but not least their insaningly hectic schedule produced by none other than father SM =.= i think i prefer people disliking dbsk than claiming that eitehr they are talentless or dont work as hard because those 2 facts im positive that anyone who thinks that is mistaken.
AS wrong as it is, judging people from the surface is unavoidable and not bias. yes im guilty of this. But thats the way things are. Not everyone has the time to sit down and analyse idols/groups to judge talent and all. its not bias considering generally we judge almost everything and everyone by their cover >< i know as im talking now, i know little about many JE artists. But thats when charisma comes in i guess. XDD i know from personal experience, i did the same to dbsk, and kinda brushed them aside after laughing my ass off calling them gay and saying hero and u-know were gay names. XDD *good old memories ^^* this stuff is unavoidable ><
QUOTE
Unlike music artists such as DBSK, who only has to devote much of their time perfecting their music, they don't have to work as hard as all-round idols do, and work is less complicated for them.
i like reading your posts, i think they make alot of sense but nevertheless i dont agree with that statement. i understand our oppinions vary but i think thats unfair to say that dbsk dont have to work as hard as all-round-idols. Just because dbsk dont venture off into other categories within the Ent. Indus. doesnt make them any less hardworking. While "all-rounder-idols" are constantly training and improving in different areas, they are generally just skimming the surface. Whereas, though DBSK dont exactly "explore" the other parts of the industry, they are exploring and music wise more "indepth". Like you said earlier that JE artists tend to have a "repiditiveness" in their music. JE idols unfortunately arent given the chance to furtehr study music and improve. Im not trying to degrade either, all i want to say it that; while "all-rounder-idols" are working on a range of projects, dbsk are working too, maybe not on the same tasks but working nonetheless. Their hardwork and effort could be seen by how far theyve come, their music and last but not least their insaningly hectic schedule produced by none other than father SM =.= i think i prefer people disliking dbsk than claiming that eitehr they are talentless or dont work as hard because those 2 facts im positive that anyone who thinks that is mistaken.
AS wrong as it is, judging people from the surface is unavoidable and not bias. yes im guilty of this. But thats the way things are. Not everyone has the time to sit down and analyse idols/groups to judge talent and all. its not bias considering generally we judge almost everything and everyone by their cover >< i know as im talking now, i know little about many JE artists. But thats when charisma comes in i guess. XDD i know from personal experience, i did the same to dbsk, and kinda brushed them aside after laughing my ass off calling them gay and saying hero and u-know were gay names. XDD *good old memories ^^* this stuff is unavoidable ><
^ I believe we have already been through this topic before...and it seems you have misinterpreted my comments...I NEVER implied that DBSK are not as hard-working as the all-around idols are...my mere statement was that because there's just so much all-round idols need to learn & all the different skills they need to accumulate from different areas of profession, their work is more complicated, they need to focus on so many different things all at once, it's very stressful. And they need to work extra hard just to go by all the work they have to do & dealing with the stress they may have. It's very difficult to multi-task, it's complicated & often confusing. And this is why I have a great amount of respect for idols who have to multi-task.
I used to have a job that required me to multi-task, and it was very tiring, often your mind is so confused with all the different work that you had to do at the same time. Sometimes you go crazy because of the extra stress, and it effects your performance. So I can understand how tough it is for those idols who have to multi-task. Except I suspect it's even harder for them than it was for me, since their lives & their work are constantly put under the microscope for the world to see. Any bit of mistake they do, it would be so obvious for the world to see & ppl are far more critical about it.
So I never in any way implied that DBSK are not hard-working, just that their work is a bit simpler & less complicated than those idols who have to do so much in different areas. They have much more time to focus on their main area of profession, which is their music, for most of the time, that's the only area they mainly just need to focus on & have much more time on improving & perfecting this main area of profession.
Unlike all those rather pitiful idols who have their hands tied doing so many different things all at once, understandably, work is more complicated for them.
DBSK may be just as hardworking as some of those idols...all I'm saying is that work is more complicated for the idols, the stress of multi-tasking is not only physically very challenging, but also mentally too. I have had a taste of it before, so I can understand how difficult it is. But I would not be surprised if work & life for the idols in showbiz is much more complicated, they have a whole lot more to endure, to top of all the multi-tasking they have to do, their lives, their work, everything they do is constantly being observed by the public. So there's more pressure on the idols. Not only do these idols have to multi-task, but it also means they have more workload, and less rest...and often that can lead to poorer concentration, which subsequently can lead to more mistakes made, and in turn, that could attract more criticisms from the public.
I hope you understand the point I'm trying to make here.
A cousin of a friend of mine works alongside idols like this, she understands how complicated work is particularly for them, there's more pressure on them, more expectations from the public. I personally have also experienced a career similar like that with the stress of multi-tasking, only that work for those idols is probably twice or even 3 times as stressful as mine was.
So overall, I never implied in any way that DBSK are not as hardworking as those idols...only it's understandable that work is more complicated for those idols. There's a lot of mental & physical pressure on them, and the workload itself is very strenuous & complicated.
I used to have a job that required me to multi-task, and it was very tiring, often your mind is so confused with all the different work that you had to do at the same time. Sometimes you go crazy because of the extra stress, and it effects your performance. So I can understand how tough it is for those idols who have to multi-task. Except I suspect it's even harder for them than it was for me, since their lives & their work are constantly put under the microscope for the world to see. Any bit of mistake they do, it would be so obvious for the world to see & ppl are far more critical about it.
So I never in any way implied that DBSK are not hard-working, just that their work is a bit simpler & less complicated than those idols who have to do so much in different areas. They have much more time to focus on their main area of profession, which is their music, for most of the time, that's the only area they mainly just need to focus on & have much more time on improving & perfecting this main area of profession.
Unlike all those rather pitiful idols who have their hands tied doing so many different things all at once, understandably, work is more complicated for them.
DBSK may be just as hardworking as some of those idols...all I'm saying is that work is more complicated for the idols, the stress of multi-tasking is not only physically very challenging, but also mentally too. I have had a taste of it before, so I can understand how difficult it is. But I would not be surprised if work & life for the idols in showbiz is much more complicated, they have a whole lot more to endure, to top of all the multi-tasking they have to do, their lives, their work, everything they do is constantly being observed by the public. So there's more pressure on the idols. Not only do these idols have to multi-task, but it also means they have more workload, and less rest...and often that can lead to poorer concentration, which subsequently can lead to more mistakes made, and in turn, that could attract more criticisms from the public.
I hope you understand the point I'm trying to make here.
A cousin of a friend of mine works alongside idols like this, she understands how complicated work is particularly for them, there's more pressure on them, more expectations from the public. I personally have also experienced a career similar like that with the stress of multi-tasking, only that work for those idols is probably twice or even 3 times as stressful as mine was.
So overall, I never implied in any way that DBSK are not as hardworking as those idols...only it's understandable that work is more complicated for those idols. There's a lot of mental & physical pressure on them, and the workload itself is very strenuous & complicated.
You should compare Super Junior and JE. Similar concepts: versatility.
Versatility vs. Skilled In One Area.
How you view talent is subjective, your preference will determine which group's fan you become.
What C♥KAT-TUN~Shun has said makes a lot of sense. I feel sorry for JE fans whenever the media labels JE boys as talentless hacks. Each boy is unique and some do really excellent work in a particular field.
I can't stand substandard singing, so I find it hard to get into JE groups. No amount of talk will convince me otherwise. I just enjoy the certain aspects that each JE boy excels in. For example, I love Matsujun's acting but I totally avoid hearing live performances of his singing. I like to watch Akanishi Jin act, he's handsome and all but I don't enjoy his singing performances.
DBSK and JE are actually similar in that they're very manufactured, heavily promoted and that's why people like to hate on them. Not only boybands, much of mainstream pop can be very manufactured and tiring. For me I don't even like jpop or kpop styled music in general. Prefer jrock or western rnb. But there's this quite overrated guy named Kim Jaejoong who has everything i need in an idol and that's why I'm even in this forum.
Just stay true to what you like.
Versatility vs. Skilled In One Area.
How you view talent is subjective, your preference will determine which group's fan you become.
What C♥KAT-TUN~Shun has said makes a lot of sense. I feel sorry for JE fans whenever the media labels JE boys as talentless hacks. Each boy is unique and some do really excellent work in a particular field.
I can't stand substandard singing, so I find it hard to get into JE groups. No amount of talk will convince me otherwise. I just enjoy the certain aspects that each JE boy excels in. For example, I love Matsujun's acting but I totally avoid hearing live performances of his singing. I like to watch Akanishi Jin act, he's handsome and all but I don't enjoy his singing performances.
DBSK and JE are actually similar in that they're very manufactured, heavily promoted and that's why people like to hate on them. Not only boybands, much of mainstream pop can be very manufactured and tiring. For me I don't even like jpop or kpop styled music in general. Prefer jrock or western rnb. But there's this quite overrated guy named Kim Jaejoong who has everything i need in an idol and that's why I'm even in this forum.
Just stay true to what you like.
^I agree with ramenramen7 that some of the JE guys are not really loved for their music, but their acting...a fine example is Matsujun. I've been a fan of him since his 'Gokusen' days, but I was never fond of his singing voice, frankly, I don't think he can sing that well, I think he's probably the weakest singer in Arashi. But despite that, his main trademark is actually his fantastic acting skills, it's what many of his fans love him mainly for.
As for Jin...as much as I like him & he is part of my fav group KAT-TUN after all...but I just don't like his acting at all, really, he's just very mediocre in that area. I tried watching 'Yukan Club', 'Anego' & 'Gokusen 2', but Jin's acting in those dramas were really just very average & very stiff...I found myself drawn to the other actors in the dramas instead. Like in 'Yukan Club', although Jin was the lead, but it was his bandmate Junno who caught my attention in the drama.
In G2, it was Kame who out-shined Jin for me...Kame, who is a much better actor, and is widely considered the best actor in KAT-TUN...Jin on the other hand, just faded into the background, I barely even took notice of him.
'Anego' was worse for me, I found the drama very boring in itself, I skipped most episodes of it.
Seriously, acting is probably Jin's biggest weakness as a idol...frankly, I'm not fond of him as a actor, he's a much better singer & performer. He has a new movie 'BANDAGE' coming out in January next year (which is also his movie debut), I'm hoping his acting skills has improved since 'Yukan Club'.
But, what he lacks in, Jin certainly makes up for it with his musical skills, because singing is Jin's main trademark, it's what most people love him for; his singing & performance skills.
But his gorgeous looks helps too.
However, in spite of the fondness I have for Jin, I have to admit that I still think he is very much over-rated...because I don't think he is all that impressive as a all-round idol. Sure he's very good in the music area, but he lacks a bit of versatility as a all-round idol...and I think the main problem with that is his average acting skill, I think it is his biggest let-down. Acting is a crucial part of being a idol. Although Jin is famous for his musical skills...but at the same time, he is also quite notorious for his mediocre acting.
Another reason I find Jin very over-rated, is because I feel that many of the other KAT-TUN members are more talented & versatile than he is, some of them can sing very well too & can act better, but they're still no where near as popular as he is over all, so they're very under-rated in my opinion.
There's also other JE guys who I think are more versatile than Jin over all.
I think some of the JE guys are really good singers & performers too, some do have talents & potentials in this area. Some of their live performances I've seen I thought were even better & more impressive than some of DBSK's I've seen...and some of the JE guys I think are better dancers & performers than some of the DBSK members.
That's my opinion...but seriously, some of the live performances of some JE guys I've seen I thought really were very impressive
As for Jin...as much as I like him & he is part of my fav group KAT-TUN after all...but I just don't like his acting at all, really, he's just very mediocre in that area. I tried watching 'Yukan Club', 'Anego' & 'Gokusen 2', but Jin's acting in those dramas were really just very average & very stiff...I found myself drawn to the other actors in the dramas instead. Like in 'Yukan Club', although Jin was the lead, but it was his bandmate Junno who caught my attention in the drama.
In G2, it was Kame who out-shined Jin for me...Kame, who is a much better actor, and is widely considered the best actor in KAT-TUN...Jin on the other hand, just faded into the background, I barely even took notice of him.
'Anego' was worse for me, I found the drama very boring in itself, I skipped most episodes of it.
Seriously, acting is probably Jin's biggest weakness as a idol...frankly, I'm not fond of him as a actor, he's a much better singer & performer. He has a new movie 'BANDAGE' coming out in January next year (which is also his movie debut), I'm hoping his acting skills has improved since 'Yukan Club'.
But, what he lacks in, Jin certainly makes up for it with his musical skills, because singing is Jin's main trademark, it's what most people love him for; his singing & performance skills.
But his gorgeous looks helps too.
However, in spite of the fondness I have for Jin, I have to admit that I still think he is very much over-rated...because I don't think he is all that impressive as a all-round idol. Sure he's very good in the music area, but he lacks a bit of versatility as a all-round idol...and I think the main problem with that is his average acting skill, I think it is his biggest let-down. Acting is a crucial part of being a idol. Although Jin is famous for his musical skills...but at the same time, he is also quite notorious for his mediocre acting.
Another reason I find Jin very over-rated, is because I feel that many of the other KAT-TUN members are more talented & versatile than he is, some of them can sing very well too & can act better, but they're still no where near as popular as he is over all, so they're very under-rated in my opinion.
There's also other JE guys who I think are more versatile than Jin over all.
I think some of the JE guys are really good singers & performers too, some do have talents & potentials in this area. Some of their live performances I've seen I thought were even better & more impressive than some of DBSK's I've seen...and some of the JE guys I think are better dancers & performers than some of the DBSK members.
That's my opinion...but seriously, some of the live performances of some JE guys I've seen I thought really were very impressive
QUOTE (C♥KAT-TUN~Shun @ Nov 20 2009 1 25 AM)
Seriously, acting is probably Jin's biggest weakness as a idol...frankly, I'm not fond of him as a actor, he's a much better singer & performer. He has a new movie 'BANDAGE' coming out in January next year (which is also his movie debut), I'm hoping his acting skills has improved since 'Yukan Club'.
I think some of the JE guys are really good singers & performers too, some do have talents & potentials in this area. Some of their live performances I've seen I thought were even better & more impressive than some of DBSK's I've seen...and some of the JE guys I think are better dancers & performers than some of the DBSK members.
That's my opinion...but seriously, some of the live performances of some JE guys I've seen I thought really were very impressive
I think some of the JE guys are really good singers & performers too, some do have talents & potentials in this area. Some of their live performances I've seen I thought were even better & more impressive than some of DBSK's I've seen...and some of the JE guys I think are better dancers & performers than some of the DBSK members.
That's my opinion...but seriously, some of the live performances of some JE guys I've seen I thought really were very impressive
Hi C♥KAT-TUN~Shun
Yes I agree Jin is just an average actor..As I've said, I like to watch him only, he can't act but he has charisma.
Can you point me to some good live performances of JE guys, if you don't mind?
I've only watched a few before...mainly Jin's solos (i think nice but average), and some of Ohno Satoshi's solos (slightly above average). I love voices with beautiful timbres (i can't stand nasal voices), and explosive dancing.If it's too much trouble, I'll find out myself yeah. I always like trying new things...planning to catch up on stuff outside of dbsk after my exams next week. One must always keep an open mind and find beauty in all sorts of entertainment.
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